Interview with Demet Demir, A Turkish Transgender Activist
“Demet’s Pink House”
In this article you can find an interview and a biography of Demet Demir, one of the most vocal LGBT activists in Turkey. She is a transgender and winner of the International Lesbian and Gay Human Rights Commission 1997 Felipa de Souza Award.
I am planning to establish a “Pink House” where I could provide a shelter for Turkish gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders.
I knew Demet Demir’s name and heard that she was fighting for human rights, especially for the transgender community.
I got her phone number from Human Rights Association (IHD). When I called her, I found out that she was such a lovely and nice person and we decided to meet for a couple of drinks.
When I met her, I had so many questions to ask therefore we met for a second time and this time I was a lot ready. I had pen, paper, recording machine and a cameraman with me!
Are Turkish transsexuals and travesties organized? It seems like they are less organized than gays and lesbians.
You are correct. The transgender community is more apolitical than the other groups. Considering that 99 percent of us are forced to make their living with prostitution, they are more into individual gains; and that’s understandable.
In fact before gays and lesbians, transgenders started to organize first to raise their voices against the violence; but unfortunately it didn’t last.
In Lambda Istanbul there are three transgenders including myself. Although a lot of my friends want to join us, they couldn’t because of they don’t want to face with more obstacles; considering that the media and the law system is against us.
I know other transgenders that are working politically just like me, but except me there is no one who is doing this constantly for 24 years.
How did your political identity develop? Has your sexual identity posed an obstacle in your political career?
I joined the left movement when I was 18. They put me in jail after 1980 military coup. I stayed in jail for 8 months in 1982.
I remember finding my genders attractive even when I was 3-4 years old. I thought that was normal till I became a teenager. When I was 13, I tried to hide my feeling in order to prevent abuses. It took me a couple of years to understand my sexual orientation; I was 17 when I finally did.
It was always difficult to have a political and sexual identity at the same time, because most of the people in the left movement consider homosexuality or transexuality a bourgeois disease. They disowned me because of my sexual orientation. I decided to put aside my sexual orientation in order to serve for the community but I still wasn’t accepted.
At first I was hiding my sexual orientation easily because I was dressing like a man; but when I was put into a prison my friends found out about my sexual identity.
In 1988 I met with Ibrahim Eren from Radical Green Movement. I learnt how to fight for human rights from him. Since than I am in trouble!
In 1991 I was in prison for 2 months. Did you know that I tried to file lawsuit every time they beat me but I didn’t gain any result?
The results of September 12,1980 military coup continue to affect our daily lives. Back on those days, life used to be very tough for political activists and transgenders. Police officers aren’t that violent anymore.
For 10 years gays and for 3-5 years lesbians are becoming more visible. There are some non-governmental organizations that we could join; compared to past, life is a lot easier for transgenders.
As I said before I’ve been in the political arena for 24 years and I can easily say things have changed a lot in the last 5 years. My gay friends can easily issue press statement without hiding their faces.
I was a candidate for a local government position in 1999 election. Although I wasn’t elected, my candidacy itself was a big issue.
You said that it was more difficult to be a transgender in the past. Can you tell us more about what transgenders used to face?
Around 1985’s transgenders in Istanbul were forcibly sent to small cities such as Eskisehir, Izmit, Gebze. If Istanbul doesn’t accept you, how can a small city accept?
Polices used to put us in custody and take everything we had and leave us deserted in Belgrade Forest (a forest area near Istanbul). Things were really bad back then.
You just earned your right to receive pension, didn’t you? Will you inform us how you retired and how you earned your pension?
As you know in Turkey and in some other countries, there is no other option for transgenders but become prostitutes. How else can one make a living? The system forces us to become prostitutes. If one wants to work, he/she should reject his/her sexual orientation.
I had a gender surgery in 1996. The lawsuit in order to get a woman identity card lasted for 1.5 years. At first although I was an effeminate male, I was able to work at some workshops and press studios; and I had insurance for 3 years.
After the surgery, one of my relatives helped me work in a company so that I became eligible to retire. The only obstacle was I had to pay the retirement fee for the period that I didn’t work. But I couldn’t pay them on time and that delayed my retirement.
I needed to get a court order so that the insurance company could accept my new gender. The person that I was dealing at the insurance company was very homophobic, he gave me a hard time but finally I won. I’ve been getting my retirement salary since July 2004. My retirement benefit is my only guarantee. I also have a small apartment and that’s all I have.
That’s what we gained after years of struggling: Limited gender benefits!
What do you think about media’s attitude towards transgenders?
Most of the news related with us is published by the leftist newspapers but I don’t think it is enough. In the media there is a covert prohibition about transgenders. They didn’t even inform their readers about recent Lambda’s press statement. (Lambda Istanbul condemned the murder of a transgender by issuing a press statement). I didn’t see any news on TV either.
Except Agenda (Gundem) and Republic (Cumhuriyet) newspapers, there was no news in the media about the gay pride activities organized by Lambda Istanbul. I saw a little column on Radical (Radikal) newspaper about Lambda Istanbul’s telephone help line.
These aren’t satisfactory at all. One has to be “interesting” so that he or she could be a news story. One must be robbed, be tortured or attack someone; otherwise the media doesn’t recognize us.
Of course Lambda Istanbul and other Turkish LGBT organizations must learn how to deal with the media. We still lack the vision for it.
What do you think about the women’s right movement in Turkey?
I joined to women’s rights movement. I started working with women in 1989. But some of the socialist women were against us and they wanted us to go somewhere else.
As a matter of fact, we are facing more violence than women! The recent Feminist Congress had a lot of hot debates because of us. They let some male participants speak in the congress, why didn’t they let me speak?
What is your retirement plans? You were talking about writing a book, what will it be about?
I’ve been planning to write an autobiography for years. I had to postpone it and I think it turned out to be a better idea because I saw and lived more. There are a few people that know the era that I used to live. I am both an observer and a victim of that period.
The new generation had no idea about how we used to live. My book will be about my childhood, sexuality, political identity, violence that I faced, my depressions, etc.
I hope I will find funds to make this project a reality. My goals are finishing this book in the next 2 years and having it also published outside Turkey.
If I could achieve my goal, I want to travel and live like a human being from now on. With the money, I am planning to help Lambda Istanbul and establish a “Pink House” where I could provide a shelter for Turkish gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders.
ABOUT DEMET DEMIR:
Demet Demir, winner of the International Lesbian and Gay Human Rights Commission 1997 Felipa de Souza Award.
Demet Demir was born in 1961, in Yalova, Turkey. She became politically active in 1979 and shortly after Labour Day, 1980, she was arrested and held for ten days. Following the 1980 military coup she was sentenced to 15 months in jail, and released after 8 months.
In the 1980s, conditions were not what they had been in the ‘70s; old friends in Left organizations began to ostracize her because of her sexual orientation. She had started to explore and assert her gender identity differences, and this soon became a serious issue; she began losing jobs because of it. She became full time in 1985 and finally had gender reassignment surgery in 1995, and as is the general rule in Turkey, was therefore unable to earn her living in any way other than through prostitution.
In 1988 Demet made contact with a newly organizing gay liberation group, operating under the name, "Radical Democratic Green Party". Through this group she became acquainted with the idea of homosexual rights, and took the opportunity to apply her political background and skills to various tasks undertaken by this organization. She wrote articles for the organization’s bulletin, ‘Greenpeace’.
Demet became a member of the (Turkish) Human Rights Organization in 1989. She established the first sexual minorities commission within HRO, but was unable to pursue her cause for lack of interest and support from the Organization at large. She was responsible for printing up and distributing the first pink triangle badges in Turkey, and participated in the feminist movement and its organization, issuing a report for the first women’s congress in Turkey, and has also worked in organization fighting Aids-related illness. She took part in the campaign against article 159, which prevented married women working without their husbands’ consent, and article 438, which decreases the punishment by one third in cases where the female victim is a prostitute. These articles were finally changed following protest campaigns by NGOs.
In 1989, Demet traveled to Ankara as a journalist for the bulletin, "Greenpeace" to observe a court trial. There her ID, which depicted her as a male, differed from her female appearance. She was questioned four times, tortured and beaten. Her purpose was questioned even after she presented a press card and she was told that as she was a gay she had no reason for her presence there.
In 1991, Demet was taken from her home to a police station, and was tortured. She was beaten again after requesting contact with her solicitor. At one point she was even allowed to see him, but was then transferred to another police station where her whereabouts would be unknown. In addition to beatings and other forms of torture.
Two days after an interview with Demet concerning this harassment was published in a weekly magazine, she was once again arrested. In the interview, Demet had mentioned that homosexuality was not defined as illegal in the 1924 Constitution written by Atatürk, the founder of the Turkish Republic; as a result she was accused of insulting Atatürk. She was forced to sign false statements following beatings, and was once again moved from one police station to another. She took a doctor’s report to prove that she was tortured to court and was acquitted, but a higher court overturned the previous judgement, and she was sentenced to 2 months imprisonment without even being allowed to take an action about the torture. This case was documented in Amnesty International’s "Turkey 1992" report. Demet applied for 50 million Turkish Lira (about $7,000) compensation, but was blocked in this action by special laws.
Demet Demir is quite well known for her activism, thanks to newspaper and television reports. She continues to maintain a leadership role in her struggle against the harassment and intimidation against the transgender community in Istanbul.
Original Interview: November 20, 2004
by Ayliz BASKIN, BIA News Center
translated into English by KAOS GL
In this article you can find an interview and a biography of Demet Demir, one of the most vocal LGBT activists in Turkey. She is a transgender and winner of the International Lesbian and Gay Human Rights Commission 1997 Felipa de Souza Award.
I am planning to establish a “Pink House” where I could provide a shelter for Turkish gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders.
I knew Demet Demir’s name and heard that she was fighting for human rights, especially for the transgender community.
I got her phone number from Human Rights Association (IHD). When I called her, I found out that she was such a lovely and nice person and we decided to meet for a couple of drinks.
When I met her, I had so many questions to ask therefore we met for a second time and this time I was a lot ready. I had pen, paper, recording machine and a cameraman with me!
Are Turkish transsexuals and travesties organized? It seems like they are less organized than gays and lesbians.
You are correct. The transgender community is more apolitical than the other groups. Considering that 99 percent of us are forced to make their living with prostitution, they are more into individual gains; and that’s understandable.
In fact before gays and lesbians, transgenders started to organize first to raise their voices against the violence; but unfortunately it didn’t last.
In Lambda Istanbul there are three transgenders including myself. Although a lot of my friends want to join us, they couldn’t because of they don’t want to face with more obstacles; considering that the media and the law system is against us.
I know other transgenders that are working politically just like me, but except me there is no one who is doing this constantly for 24 years.
How did your political identity develop? Has your sexual identity posed an obstacle in your political career?
I joined the left movement when I was 18. They put me in jail after 1980 military coup. I stayed in jail for 8 months in 1982.
I remember finding my genders attractive even when I was 3-4 years old. I thought that was normal till I became a teenager. When I was 13, I tried to hide my feeling in order to prevent abuses. It took me a couple of years to understand my sexual orientation; I was 17 when I finally did.
It was always difficult to have a political and sexual identity at the same time, because most of the people in the left movement consider homosexuality or transexuality a bourgeois disease. They disowned me because of my sexual orientation. I decided to put aside my sexual orientation in order to serve for the community but I still wasn’t accepted.
At first I was hiding my sexual orientation easily because I was dressing like a man; but when I was put into a prison my friends found out about my sexual identity.
In 1988 I met with Ibrahim Eren from Radical Green Movement. I learnt how to fight for human rights from him. Since than I am in trouble!
In 1991 I was in prison for 2 months. Did you know that I tried to file lawsuit every time they beat me but I didn’t gain any result?
The results of September 12,1980 military coup continue to affect our daily lives. Back on those days, life used to be very tough for political activists and transgenders. Police officers aren’t that violent anymore.
For 10 years gays and for 3-5 years lesbians are becoming more visible. There are some non-governmental organizations that we could join; compared to past, life is a lot easier for transgenders.
As I said before I’ve been in the political arena for 24 years and I can easily say things have changed a lot in the last 5 years. My gay friends can easily issue press statement without hiding their faces.
I was a candidate for a local government position in 1999 election. Although I wasn’t elected, my candidacy itself was a big issue.
You said that it was more difficult to be a transgender in the past. Can you tell us more about what transgenders used to face?
Around 1985’s transgenders in Istanbul were forcibly sent to small cities such as Eskisehir, Izmit, Gebze. If Istanbul doesn’t accept you, how can a small city accept?
Polices used to put us in custody and take everything we had and leave us deserted in Belgrade Forest (a forest area near Istanbul). Things were really bad back then.
You just earned your right to receive pension, didn’t you? Will you inform us how you retired and how you earned your pension?
As you know in Turkey and in some other countries, there is no other option for transgenders but become prostitutes. How else can one make a living? The system forces us to become prostitutes. If one wants to work, he/she should reject his/her sexual orientation.
I had a gender surgery in 1996. The lawsuit in order to get a woman identity card lasted for 1.5 years. At first although I was an effeminate male, I was able to work at some workshops and press studios; and I had insurance for 3 years.
After the surgery, one of my relatives helped me work in a company so that I became eligible to retire. The only obstacle was I had to pay the retirement fee for the period that I didn’t work. But I couldn’t pay them on time and that delayed my retirement.
I needed to get a court order so that the insurance company could accept my new gender. The person that I was dealing at the insurance company was very homophobic, he gave me a hard time but finally I won. I’ve been getting my retirement salary since July 2004. My retirement benefit is my only guarantee. I also have a small apartment and that’s all I have.
That’s what we gained after years of struggling: Limited gender benefits!
What do you think about media’s attitude towards transgenders?
Most of the news related with us is published by the leftist newspapers but I don’t think it is enough. In the media there is a covert prohibition about transgenders. They didn’t even inform their readers about recent Lambda’s press statement. (Lambda Istanbul condemned the murder of a transgender by issuing a press statement). I didn’t see any news on TV either.
Except Agenda (Gundem) and Republic (Cumhuriyet) newspapers, there was no news in the media about the gay pride activities organized by Lambda Istanbul. I saw a little column on Radical (Radikal) newspaper about Lambda Istanbul’s telephone help line.
These aren’t satisfactory at all. One has to be “interesting” so that he or she could be a news story. One must be robbed, be tortured or attack someone; otherwise the media doesn’t recognize us.
Of course Lambda Istanbul and other Turkish LGBT organizations must learn how to deal with the media. We still lack the vision for it.
What do you think about the women’s right movement in Turkey?
I joined to women’s rights movement. I started working with women in 1989. But some of the socialist women were against us and they wanted us to go somewhere else.
As a matter of fact, we are facing more violence than women! The recent Feminist Congress had a lot of hot debates because of us. They let some male participants speak in the congress, why didn’t they let me speak?
What is your retirement plans? You were talking about writing a book, what will it be about?
I’ve been planning to write an autobiography for years. I had to postpone it and I think it turned out to be a better idea because I saw and lived more. There are a few people that know the era that I used to live. I am both an observer and a victim of that period.
The new generation had no idea about how we used to live. My book will be about my childhood, sexuality, political identity, violence that I faced, my depressions, etc.
I hope I will find funds to make this project a reality. My goals are finishing this book in the next 2 years and having it also published outside Turkey.
If I could achieve my goal, I want to travel and live like a human being from now on. With the money, I am planning to help Lambda Istanbul and establish a “Pink House” where I could provide a shelter for Turkish gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders.
ABOUT DEMET DEMIR:
Demet Demir, winner of the International Lesbian and Gay Human Rights Commission 1997 Felipa de Souza Award.
Demet Demir was born in 1961, in Yalova, Turkey. She became politically active in 1979 and shortly after Labour Day, 1980, she was arrested and held for ten days. Following the 1980 military coup she was sentenced to 15 months in jail, and released after 8 months.
In the 1980s, conditions were not what they had been in the ‘70s; old friends in Left organizations began to ostracize her because of her sexual orientation. She had started to explore and assert her gender identity differences, and this soon became a serious issue; she began losing jobs because of it. She became full time in 1985 and finally had gender reassignment surgery in 1995, and as is the general rule in Turkey, was therefore unable to earn her living in any way other than through prostitution.
In 1988 Demet made contact with a newly organizing gay liberation group, operating under the name, "Radical Democratic Green Party". Through this group she became acquainted with the idea of homosexual rights, and took the opportunity to apply her political background and skills to various tasks undertaken by this organization. She wrote articles for the organization’s bulletin, ‘Greenpeace’.
Demet became a member of the (Turkish) Human Rights Organization in 1989. She established the first sexual minorities commission within HRO, but was unable to pursue her cause for lack of interest and support from the Organization at large. She was responsible for printing up and distributing the first pink triangle badges in Turkey, and participated in the feminist movement and its organization, issuing a report for the first women’s congress in Turkey, and has also worked in organization fighting Aids-related illness. She took part in the campaign against article 159, which prevented married women working without their husbands’ consent, and article 438, which decreases the punishment by one third in cases where the female victim is a prostitute. These articles were finally changed following protest campaigns by NGOs.
In 1989, Demet traveled to Ankara as a journalist for the bulletin, "Greenpeace" to observe a court trial. There her ID, which depicted her as a male, differed from her female appearance. She was questioned four times, tortured and beaten. Her purpose was questioned even after she presented a press card and she was told that as she was a gay she had no reason for her presence there.
In 1991, Demet was taken from her home to a police station, and was tortured. She was beaten again after requesting contact with her solicitor. At one point she was even allowed to see him, but was then transferred to another police station where her whereabouts would be unknown. In addition to beatings and other forms of torture.
Two days after an interview with Demet concerning this harassment was published in a weekly magazine, she was once again arrested. In the interview, Demet had mentioned that homosexuality was not defined as illegal in the 1924 Constitution written by Atatürk, the founder of the Turkish Republic; as a result she was accused of insulting Atatürk. She was forced to sign false statements following beatings, and was once again moved from one police station to another. She took a doctor’s report to prove that she was tortured to court and was acquitted, but a higher court overturned the previous judgement, and she was sentenced to 2 months imprisonment without even being allowed to take an action about the torture. This case was documented in Amnesty International’s "Turkey 1992" report. Demet applied for 50 million Turkish Lira (about $7,000) compensation, but was blocked in this action by special laws.
Demet Demir is quite well known for her activism, thanks to newspaper and television reports. She continues to maintain a leadership role in her struggle against the harassment and intimidation against the transgender community in Istanbul.
Original Interview: November 20, 2004
by Ayliz BASKIN, BIA News Center
translated into English by KAOS GL
